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Discussion on: Server Sent Events are still not production ready after a decade. A lesson for me, a warning for you!

sleavely profile image
Joakim Hedlund • Edited

Interesting discovery! As soon as I reached the "20 minutes" paragraph I assumed it was a proxy or router along the way that killed the connection due to inactivity. I didn't expect the lack of Content-length to be the culprit. Love the comparison table.

I disagree a with the premise for the title, though. I get the impression that the application has been built to use client requests as a means to trigger SSE responses. SSE is great for pushing auxiliary real-time information, but the client should not receive responses based on its own actions through the SSE channel; for e.g. logging in, it should still receive a response as part of its regular RESTful request.

I think Server-Sent Events are production ready, but I think their usage should be limited to messages like "oh hey you have 2 new notifications" that leaves the client to decide whether to fetch the notifications instead of "Oh hey your Aunt May called and asked how the [...]". Much like getting an SMS letting you know that you've got a voice mail, but leaving you to decide whether to listen to it.

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Mike Talbot Author

Hmmm. Well they wouldn't work well for notifications in your last point given the limitations. SSE are frequently described as being valid choice for something like a chat app - which clearly they aren't. I can find no documentation other than the spec that indicates otherwise. Many applications absolutely require back end initiated communication - anything which relays effectively. If that is not working, the entire principle of server sent events is broken to my mind.

  • You can't write a chat app - because new messages won't be delivered - let alone what I'm using it for.

I guess somewhere splattered all over articles about it I'd like to see: this won't work through some routers or networks. Hence I wrote this. It's not production ready for a whole series of use cases that are documented by others.

sleavely profile image
Joakim Hedlund

I should have expanded on my notification example, sorry about that. What I meant was that the client has the ability to send a request to /voicemails and receive a response as part of that request, making the SSE a helpful nicety. Progressive enhancement, if you will :)

A chat app implies two-way communication though, so I think conceptually SSE is ill-suited for that purpose. If you choose to go that route - with what we've now learned in mind - I'd then implement some sort of handshake mechanism to test the connection and fall back on polling if the handshake does not complete in time.

As for corporate networks, I think it's safe to assume there will always be quirky setups that prohibit beyond-basic usage. My favorite pet peeve example of corporate stupidity are password policies that restrict lengths or confine you to latin alphanumerical characters.

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miketalbot profile image
Mike Talbot Author

Yes we see that all the time too on passwords.

That and the fact that 24% of my users are on IE11. Nice. It's the one thing as a developer of enterprise apps that always concerns me - uses browser stats for visitors - clearly not many devs are running IE11 on their development machine while browsing docs - so the stats always seem very low.

I know where you are coming from with your point on progressive enhancement and the use of SSE. My point is that the documentation says "it does this", many articles about it says "it does this". And then there is a paragraph that says this way down in the bowels of the thing:

Authors are also cautioned that HTTP chunking can have unexpected negative effects on the reliability of this protocol. Where possible, chunking should be disabled for serving event streams unless the rate of messages is high enough for this not to matter.

"Where possible" is the killer :)

And then somewhere else entirely you can find a reference to the fact you can't actually disable chunking on a network you don't own.

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