This. You like PHP? Okay, great, keep doing it. But don't pretend like all languages are same because they clearly aren't. You can't compare a language which was designed in a small period of time as a small group of utilities with a language designed by people with PhDs in a long period of time and which is used for completely different purposes.
Of course you can compare them, that's fruitful. PHP has also tremendously evolved since the early days. If anything, I benefit a lot from my knowledge of haskell and functional programming / category theory concepts when writing PHP. The article is not about any technology, but the fact that putting down a language in order to make yourself seem smarter is harmful.
I love both PHP and Haskell. What I don't like is Haskell programmer thinking PHP programmers are idiots, or, conversely, PHP programmers thinking Haskell programmers are ivory-tower headscratchers that don't know how to ship stuff. Plenty of very smart people have invested a lot of time and effort into both ecosystems.
It has evolved but it's nowhere near the Haskell's level. That's a fact. I'm not saying it should be though - they are made for different purposes. Both serve their needs.
100%. In many ways, Haskell's strength is to be a playground of evolution, while PHP benefits from keeping its roots, as ugly as they might be.
A big strength of PHP is the existing ecosystem around it and its widespread adoption, partly because a lot of messy legacy systems are still around and run "fine" (fine as in, they work well enough that nobody has replaced them with something else).
I love experimenting and prototyping in Haskell, writing what I thought would be a simple API server with servant really did my head in.
There are many concepts I experiment with in Haskell that I can easily transpose to PHP.
I had some good times with pico8! Made a couple of games with it. Quite a few of my buddies are into it, I haven't fully had the need for it so far, but it is quite enticing indeed. I was planning on building some with fennel-lang.org this summer on my sabbatical, but of course many other things were interesting too.
It felt very "javascript"-y, in the sense that the prototypal inheritance and the coroutines allow you to experiment with a lot of different programming styles/patterns without feeling friction.
I heard great things about the JIT but never looked closely into it.
Yep, it shares a lot of features with JavaScript, but between coroutines, TCE and the more powerful tables compared to JS objects make it better suited, in my opinion, for just playing around with some cool FP concepts.
The landscape of languages that compile to Lua is also quite interesting; there's at least two lisp dialects (urn and fennel), a coffee-script-like with two different dialects (moonscript and yuescript) and even an ML-like (amulet)
My current "language I want to make some money with so I can call myself a pro" is rust, which I finally picked up after being turned off of it for a while. It's really a solid improvement over C++ in the bare-metal / embedded space. After that, Lua is high on the list (or retirement, hopefully :). Any resources you particularly enjoy?
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This. You like PHP? Okay, great, keep doing it. But don't pretend like all languages are same because they clearly aren't. You can't compare a language which was designed in a small period of time as a small group of utilities with a language designed by people with PhDs in a long period of time and which is used for completely different purposes.
Of course you can compare them, that's fruitful. PHP has also tremendously evolved since the early days. If anything, I benefit a lot from my knowledge of haskell and functional programming / category theory concepts when writing PHP. The article is not about any technology, but the fact that putting down a language in order to make yourself seem smarter is harmful.
I love both PHP and Haskell. What I don't like is Haskell programmer thinking PHP programmers are idiots, or, conversely, PHP programmers thinking Haskell programmers are ivory-tower headscratchers that don't know how to ship stuff. Plenty of very smart people have invested a lot of time and effort into both ecosystems.
It has evolved but it's nowhere near the Haskell's level. That's a fact. I'm not saying it should be though - they are made for different purposes. Both serve their needs.
100%. In many ways, Haskell's strength is to be a playground of evolution, while PHP benefits from keeping its roots, as ugly as they might be.
A big strength of PHP is the existing ecosystem around it and its widespread adoption, partly because a lot of messy legacy systems are still around and run "fine" (fine as in, they work well enough that nobody has replaced them with something else).
I love experimenting and prototyping in Haskell, writing what I thought would be a simple API server with servant really did my head in.
There are many concepts I experiment with in Haskell that I can easily transpose to PHP.
I have a feeling you might enjoy Lua 😅
I had some good times with pico8! Made a couple of games with it. Quite a few of my buddies are into it, I haven't fully had the need for it so far, but it is quite enticing indeed. I was planning on building some with fennel-lang.org this summer on my sabbatical, but of course many other things were interesting too.
The problem with gamedev is that your code turns to garbage super quickly. And sadly coroutines are quite expensive on pico8, if i remember correctly:
github.com/wesen/carts/tree/master...
It felt very "javascript"-y, in the sense that the prototypal inheritance and the coroutines allow you to experiment with a lot of different programming styles/patterns without feeling friction.
I heard great things about the JIT but never looked closely into it.
Yep, it shares a lot of features with JavaScript, but between coroutines, TCE and the more powerful tables compared to JS objects make it better suited, in my opinion, for just playing around with some cool FP concepts.
The landscape of languages that compile to Lua is also quite interesting; there's at least two lisp dialects (urn and fennel), a coffee-script-like with two different dialects (moonscript and yuescript) and even an ML-like (amulet)
My current "language I want to make some money with so I can call myself a pro" is rust, which I finally picked up after being turned off of it for a while. It's really a solid improvement over C++ in the bare-metal / embedded space. After that, Lua is high on the list (or retirement, hopefully :). Any resources you particularly enjoy?