If you want to hobby around, if you're looking to move from to low to middle class salaries, if your reason for learning is to have the technical knowledge to operate your own company then go for it.
If you have domain knowledge in an industry where developers are a rarity that could be high salaries in front of you.
All things software & product, honestly - FrontEnd, BackEnd, DevOps, ML - as long as we're solving massive problems.
My code is used by millions of users globally - Potatoes make me happy
All things software & product, honestly - FrontEnd, BackEnd, DevOps, ML - as long as we're solving massive problems.
My code is used by millions of users globally - Potatoes make me happy
because you're not. Age has and will never be a deciding factor in someone's success. And like i said in my comment above, people at 30 come with something just as important as tech skills which is EQ.
My entire team is 30 > and they're great. One of them started coding 3 years ago at 33 and is incredible in client meetings and product, handles stressful situations really well!
Thats one example, if you look at the landscape of most bootcamp grads, who're smashing it in their careers, you'll see a large % have had careers in other fields, sometimes completely unrelated to tech, but they bring that experience to software and change the game.
I understand your framing, yes - there needs to be goal alignment, for sure, but I wouldn't brush it as too late. Pull the right strings and you can be up and going with money/impact/position etc fairly quicky in dev :) - atleast imo
I believe we are on the same point and are talking about the same qualifiers which make 30+ developers valuable.
incredible in client meetings and product, handles stressful situations really well!
This is leadership skills
who're smashing it in their careers, you'll see a large % have had careers in other fields,
This is cross-domain skills
So when I'm talking about it being too late, I am saying the industry is going to change in the next 10 years and if you can't keep pace with it you may be unhappy 5-10 years from now or not have a salary which will allow you to pay for what you want in life.
Here in Toronto, you need a collective income of 160K in hopes to own a house.
If remote jobs became more acceptable a 60K job could be a dream true. I've helped a few friends and I would really hope we can foster more remote culture.
In Canada is much tougher than the US where high salaries, cheap houses and remote salaries are more plentiful.
I am just curious why you think this? I am in this boat so although a little disheartening to hear someone say it, I truly would love to hear your reasons for this opinion. Either way I am pushing full steam ahead but I am curious. Thanks!
EDIT: I see that your opinion is if people are looking at just the money portion of it. I appreciate the view point.
All things software & product, honestly - FrontEnd, BackEnd, DevOps, ML - as long as we're solving massive problems.
My code is used by millions of users globally - Potatoes make me happy
You're fine mate! I'm happy to put you in touch with incredible engineers who started to learn how to code at a very late age. Some for passion, some for stimulation, some for money, and in the end if you have the grit to push through, you'll do really well.
I have helped a few of my friends gain remote jobs where they earn 55K CAD working in their small town and are very happy because they earn more than most in their area.
You can enter the market, but I'm trying to have people think what ten years may bring. You need to have a long-term plan so you could put yourself in the best position.
The New Blue Collar
The industry is changing, and we are moving towards the commoditization of developers. What do I mean by the commoditization of developers? Through continuing advancement of tooling and processes, companies can create a paint by numbers workforce, which then will eventually be partially replaced through AI automation or assisted by AI.
This change is socially beneficial in the short run because more middle-class wages are going to become available.
This new type of developer is highly disposable. There will be little career progression. You can progress one step up to managing ten developers and see your career stop. (Think of a cashier who runs a self-checkout)
The New White Collar
Join a pre-seed startup in a leadership role, specialize in a cross-domain skill, specialize in frontier technology. These are roles which are not easily automated, are high paying and will have a good career progression.
Go Counter Culture
We are also seeing more life-style companies popping up.
The reason for this could be a reaction to where the industry is going.
A life-style company's purpose is to provide a fulfilling job.
I don't say career because I think progression within life-style companies are limited because company growth is intended to stay small.
How Fast Can You Go From Zero to Senior?
Just as P90X promises that you can transform your body in 90 days you can do the same in web-development industry. I strongly believe it's possible to go from Zero to Senior Developer in 90 days with the right mentor and plan in front of you.
This is all the time I have to write today. I wish I could provide more detailed information but thought this was a good starting point for me to expand on later.
Can I suggest things what 30+ people can do to best position themselves and optimize their chance of success? I certainly can and produce a post as such.
Thanks for the explanation Andrew. I really appreciate this view point. I would love to have further conversation on this when time allows. Good stuff. Thanks man.
Mike - It's discouragement like this that should only motivate you more. I am now 42. If I took this advice when I was 35 I wouldn't have the career I have today. Just know that NOTHING about the road to where you want to go is easy riding...there are many forks in the road too.
Thanks Barry I appreciate it. I am going to do this regardless and have already overcome so much to learn what I have so far. Late nights and early mornings, when I'm tired and just want to sleep in on a Saturday morning I have pushed through it. So here is to success...however we measure it.
You're too late.
If you want to hobby around, if you're looking to move from to low to middle class salaries, if your reason for learning is to have the technical knowledge to operate your own company then go for it.
If you have domain knowledge in an industry where developers are a rarity that could be high salaries in front of you.
It's never too late 😉
You're never too late why?
because you're not. Age has and will never be a deciding factor in someone's success. And like i said in my comment above, people at 30 come with something just as important as tech skills which is EQ.
My entire team is 30 > and they're great. One of them started coding 3 years ago at 33 and is incredible in client meetings and product, handles stressful situations really well!
Thats one example, if you look at the landscape of most bootcamp grads, who're smashing it in their careers, you'll see a large % have had careers in other fields, sometimes completely unrelated to tech, but they bring that experience to software and change the game.
I understand your framing, yes - there needs to be goal alignment, for sure, but I wouldn't brush it as too late. Pull the right strings and you can be up and going with money/impact/position etc fairly quicky in dev :) - atleast imo
I believe we are on the same point and are talking about the same qualifiers which make 30+ developers valuable.
This is leadership skills
This is cross-domain skills
So when I'm talking about it being too late, I am saying the industry is going to change in the next 10 years and if you can't keep pace with it you may be unhappy 5-10 years from now or not have a salary which will allow you to pay for what you want in life.
Here in Toronto, you need a collective income of 160K in hopes to own a house.
If remote jobs became more acceptable a 60K job could be a dream true. I've helped a few friends and I would really hope we can foster more remote culture.
In Canada is much tougher than the US where high salaries, cheap houses and remote salaries are more plentiful.
I am just curious why you think this? I am in this boat so although a little disheartening to hear someone say it, I truly would love to hear your reasons for this opinion. Either way I am pushing full steam ahead but I am curious. Thanks!
EDIT: I see that your opinion is if people are looking at just the money portion of it. I appreciate the view point.
You're fine mate! I'm happy to put you in touch with incredible engineers who started to learn how to code at a very late age. Some for passion, some for stimulation, some for money, and in the end if you have the grit to push through, you'll do really well.
Thanks Vaibhav! I do have the grit and will make something of it.
Hey Mike,
I commend you on your attitude:
I have helped a few of my friends gain remote jobs where they earn 55K CAD working in their small town and are very happy because they earn more than most in their area.
You can enter the market, but I'm trying to have people think what ten years may bring. You need to have a long-term plan so you could put yourself in the best position.
The New Blue Collar
The industry is changing, and we are moving towards the commoditization of developers. What do I mean by the commoditization of developers? Through continuing advancement of tooling and processes, companies can create a paint by numbers workforce, which then will eventually be partially replaced through AI automation or assisted by AI.
This change is socially beneficial in the short run because more middle-class wages are going to become available.
This new type of developer is highly disposable. There will be little career progression. You can progress one step up to managing ten developers and see your career stop. (Think of a cashier who runs a self-checkout)
The New White Collar
Join a pre-seed startup in a leadership role, specialize in a cross-domain skill, specialize in frontier technology. These are roles which are not easily automated, are high paying and will have a good career progression.
Go Counter Culture
We are also seeing more life-style companies popping up.
The reason for this could be a reaction to where the industry is going.
A life-style company's purpose is to provide a fulfilling job.
I don't say career because I think progression within life-style companies are limited because company growth is intended to stay small.
How Fast Can You Go From Zero to Senior?
Just as P90X promises that you can transform your body in 90 days you can do the same in web-development industry. I strongly believe it's possible to go from Zero to Senior Developer in 90 days with the right mentor and plan in front of you.
This is all the time I have to write today. I wish I could provide more detailed information but thought this was a good starting point for me to expand on later.
Can I suggest things what 30+ people can do to best position themselves and optimize their chance of success? I certainly can and produce a post as such.
Thanks for the explanation Andrew. I really appreciate this view point. I would love to have further conversation on this when time allows. Good stuff. Thanks man.
Mike - It's discouragement like this that should only motivate you more. I am now 42. If I took this advice when I was 35 I wouldn't have the career I have today. Just know that NOTHING about the road to where you want to go is easy riding...there are many forks in the road too.
Thanks Barry I appreciate it. I am going to do this regardless and have already overcome so much to learn what I have so far. Late nights and early mornings, when I'm tired and just want to sleep in on a Saturday morning I have pushed through it. So here is to success...however we measure it.
If you really want some motivation listen to this podcast episode
Listen to Ep. 118 - Truck Driver (George Moore) from CodeNewbie in Podcasts.