I think the main disconnect here between the way you and I view interactions is that my understanding of society is that all biases and systemic oppression is always at play in any interaction. This is why intention and self-reflection is something I value highly over reactivity (which being that I am bipolar disorder type 1 and have ADHD is something I have to work extra hard at).
I strongly disagree that it was a normal response - "thank you for choosing to use your platform to ruin my day 🥰" is absolutely manipulative, passive-aggressive, and extremely entitled. The entitlement starts from the implication her purpose was to ruin his day and straight to the expectation that she should know it would ruin his day and respect him enough not to post it (despite her disclaimer that she didn't agree with all of the points nor the tone). They aren't friends, so there's no reason for her to be that familiar with him to consider him in that way. I only see this happening to women, and most often to women of color.
That's not to say it doesn't happen outside of these power dynamics, but I'm sure we could discern in every situation some sort of pathway that allows the aggressor have the sense that it is not only okay to speak to the other person this way, despite the lack of relationship, but have the expectation that they wouldn't share any challenging feedback at all.
Had he simply said what others are saying he "really meant" behind his comment, that he found the feedback itself to be misinformed and one-sided, and that he was hurt that she shared it given she has such a large platform, I wouldn't have written this post. What he wrote is precisely the problem here, not that he was hurt.
Thank you for this constructive dialogue either way. I do appreciate talking about these things, despite that my opinions are typically very strong.
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I’d say, let’s forget about race, gender and just focus on what really matters. I’m Latino btw, always thought people would ignore me, hard to learn when people are telling you that there is a system against you, once I ignored that, I noticed people do listen and respect me, I became more confident and realized it was all in my head. makes me sad when things get labeled incorrectly cause it influences in mental health, people start thinking that because everything is against you, you are doomed. I’m my worst enemy… We shouldn’t asume people’s intentions. I personally agree with Sarah, I don’t think tailwind has a unique benefit (my opinion) but I also don’t think he was being racist or sexist. Debates like this are great, helps people make better decisions. I’d challenge his opinion, not him as a person or the system. People will always react in different ways and we don’t have control over it.
From mental health & arts to software engineer in under a year. Passionate about tech for good. Will inevitably end up writing about how coding makes me feel too…
I appreciate you taking the time to reply to me, I now feel like I understand where you're coming from more than I did before.
I think the main disconnect here between the way you and I view interactions is that my understanding of society is that all biases and systemic oppression is always at play in any interaction.
Nope, I'm behind you on this one. I agree that by default we bring our whole selves, including our biases and cultural backgrounds, to each interaction. And I actually think that perhaps it's those same biases that lead to our disconnect too, which I now interpret to stem from the following paragraph.
I strongly disagree that it was a normal response - "thank you for using your platform to ruin my day 🥰" is absolutely manipulative, passive-aggressive, and extremely entitled. The entitlement starts from the implication her purpose was to ruin his day and straight to the expectation that she should know it would ruin his day and respect him enough not to post it (despite her disclaimer that she didn't agree with all of the points nor the tone). They aren't friends, so there's no reason for her to be that familiar with him to consider him in that way. I only see this happening to women, and most often to women of color.
This must be the root of my scepticism towards your analysis - I disagree with a lot of assumptions you make in this paragraph. I can see how these assumptions lead you to the conclusions you drew, but our priors are just not the same, so we end up in different places. It could be that this is because my own lived experience and cultural background lead me to see the same words as you, yet interpret them very differently. The sentence you label as "manipulative" and "entitled" only strikes me as passive-aggressive, sarcastic and intended to convey frustration. My background leads me to think that it's okay to occasionally be passive-aggressive, sarcastic and frustrated - regardless of whether this frustration is directed at someone from within your in-group, or someone entirely different to you. Being openly, publicly frustrated with someone who is not a member of your in-group doesn't by default signal "sexism" or "racism" to me. I'm all for humanising social media, and part of that is revealing when we're hurt, which is all this sentence, in my interpretation, does. I'd like to think I'd have bitten my tongue before posting a reaction like his, but I can't rule out having reacted the same way, especially on a bad day. Would that make me racist and sexist?
And I do believe there's evidence that women are more likely to get unfairly criticised - I'm just still unable to see how this is an example of that.
Be it as it may, I think both parties involved might likely be slightly bemused if they were to know the extent to which their words are being analysed here, so I'll call it a day now. Let's agree to disagree. I am grateful for this discussion and love that you've created a space where it's okay to voice one's opinion, even if it opposes yours. I look forward to reading more from you.
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I think the main disconnect here between the way you and I view interactions is that my understanding of society is that all biases and systemic oppression is always at play in any interaction. This is why intention and self-reflection is something I value highly over reactivity (which being that I am bipolar disorder type 1 and have ADHD is something I have to work extra hard at).
I strongly disagree that it was a normal response - "thank you for choosing to use your platform to ruin my day 🥰" is absolutely manipulative, passive-aggressive, and extremely entitled. The entitlement starts from the implication her purpose was to ruin his day and straight to the expectation that she should know it would ruin his day and respect him enough not to post it (despite her disclaimer that she didn't agree with all of the points nor the tone). They aren't friends, so there's no reason for her to be that familiar with him to consider him in that way. I only see this happening to women, and most often to women of color.
That's not to say it doesn't happen outside of these power dynamics, but I'm sure we could discern in every situation some sort of pathway that allows the aggressor have the sense that it is not only okay to speak to the other person this way, despite the lack of relationship, but have the expectation that they wouldn't share any challenging feedback at all.
Had he simply said what others are saying he "really meant" behind his comment, that he found the feedback itself to be misinformed and one-sided, and that he was hurt that she shared it given she has such a large platform, I wouldn't have written this post. What he wrote is precisely the problem here, not that he was hurt.
Thank you for this constructive dialogue either way. I do appreciate talking about these things, despite that my opinions are typically very strong.
I’d say, let’s forget about race, gender and just focus on what really matters. I’m Latino btw, always thought people would ignore me, hard to learn when people are telling you that there is a system against you, once I ignored that, I noticed people do listen and respect me, I became more confident and realized it was all in my head. makes me sad when things get labeled incorrectly cause it influences in mental health, people start thinking that because everything is against you, you are doomed. I’m my worst enemy… We shouldn’t asume people’s intentions. I personally agree with Sarah, I don’t think tailwind has a unique benefit (my opinion) but I also don’t think he was being racist or sexist. Debates like this are great, helps people make better decisions. I’d challenge his opinion, not him as a person or the system. People will always react in different ways and we don’t have control over it.
I appreciate you taking the time to reply to me, I now feel like I understand where you're coming from more than I did before.
Nope, I'm behind you on this one. I agree that by default we bring our whole selves, including our biases and cultural backgrounds, to each interaction. And I actually think that perhaps it's those same biases that lead to our disconnect too, which I now interpret to stem from the following paragraph.
This must be the root of my scepticism towards your analysis - I disagree with a lot of assumptions you make in this paragraph. I can see how these assumptions lead you to the conclusions you drew, but our priors are just not the same, so we end up in different places. It could be that this is because my own lived experience and cultural background lead me to see the same words as you, yet interpret them very differently. The sentence you label as "manipulative" and "entitled" only strikes me as passive-aggressive, sarcastic and intended to convey frustration. My background leads me to think that it's okay to occasionally be passive-aggressive, sarcastic and frustrated - regardless of whether this frustration is directed at someone from within your in-group, or someone entirely different to you. Being openly, publicly frustrated with someone who is not a member of your in-group doesn't by default signal "sexism" or "racism" to me. I'm all for humanising social media, and part of that is revealing when we're hurt, which is all this sentence, in my interpretation, does. I'd like to think I'd have bitten my tongue before posting a reaction like his, but I can't rule out having reacted the same way, especially on a bad day. Would that make me racist and sexist?
And I do believe there's evidence that women are more likely to get unfairly criticised - I'm just still unable to see how this is an example of that.
Be it as it may, I think both parties involved might likely be slightly bemused if they were to know the extent to which their words are being analysed here, so I'll call it a day now. Let's agree to disagree. I am grateful for this discussion and love that you've created a space where it's okay to voice one's opinion, even if it opposes yours. I look forward to reading more from you.