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Discussion on: How to apply your coding skills to turn yourself into a self-made millionaire

bousquetn profile image
Nicolas Bousquet • Edited

You can be extremely negative on everything. But the truth is that to have great effects as you have limited own capacity, the leverage is by acting on others.

So yes some people have more than other, they are more beautiful, they are capable to earn more money than others or they are interested to not spend they whole life working and try to find ways to have more time for themselve.

Maybe they'll have other people working for them, and in exchange for providing them a work they'll be able to leverage and get what these people produce in exchange for a salary. Or just in exchange of money. This is actually a smart way to proceed.

Yes these peoples exist, and it is difficult to see that as something "bad". People that say it is bad and are trying to convince others to not do it have actually their own agenda and are trying to impose their view on others. This isn't one bit better ethically. They leverage other people for their own interest, what ever their interest is.

Many even go to the next step to use that as a way to gather more power for themselve. On the surface they promote ethical and moral things but that's just a way for them to grab power and control others. Typical of many religious people and politicians.

sebnitu profile image
Sebastian Nitu • Edited

I don't think raising class consciousness is a power grab, it's really just to help people understand the state of the world, economy and division of labor. If that understanding leads people to want to unionize or join a worker cooperative, that would be a power grab, but from the bosses to the workers which I'm 100% ok with.

I was only responding to the "become a millionaire" part of the original post, I pretty much agree with everything else. I think people should pursue a life that makes them happy, have more free time for leisure, put their labor in something they actually find fulfilling and meaningful. I just think that should be true of all workers and not just the lucky ones who "succeed" in a small business.

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theplantbaseddeveloper profile image
Stefanni Brasil Author

Hi, Sebastian and Nicolas!

I used to think this way, Sebastian. But the world does not work like that. So I just focus on having enough money for me to do what I like, giving me freedom, safety. Also I can help more people, start my social projects, etc.

Talk about social inequalities is something that I won't discuss here, but if you want to, feel free to send me a message! There is a book that changed my way of seeing some of these things that you talked about "Rich dad, poor dad", especially when he talks about taxes.

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sebnitu profile image
Sebastian Nitu

"Rich Dad, Poor Dad" is just another "how to get rich" book by a guy who got rich off of selling what you can learn in an introductory course of economics. It talks about the most basic concepts of wealth accumulation that were known since the enlightenment and the founding of capitalism. Who would have thought that owning assets is better than wage labor? In other words, the working class get screwed while the capitalist class (the people who own property/means of production) laugh all the way to the bank. It's literally what happened in 2008 and why 5 people own more wealth than the bottom 50% of the world's population combined.

I don't know, I kind of regret commenting at all. I realize a dev forum isn't the place to talk about wealth inequality, but it was just the title that set me off. Our economic system simply sucks and the whole mindset of "someday, I can be a millionaire too!" is exactly what keeps it in place.

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kspeakman profile image
Kasey Speakman • Edited

Sebastian, don't feel bad about commenting. I think you raise some excellent points, and the post was largely driven by the subject of wealth. Personally, I am not upset at economic inequities for the most part. The thing that really upsets me is that some people literally do not have enough to survive, while I have an excess, almost entirely through luck of the draw. I cannot do anything about the draw, but I can use some of my excess to help. It's quite similar to the Lending Privilege talk that Ben linked, but on a more fundamental level.

And I have to agree on that book, which I read a long time ago. It's designed to get you excited about making money, at least enough to buy more of that guy's products, without actually telling you anything useful.

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bousquetn profile image
Nicolas Bousquet

Sebastian, I understand your concerns, but you have to also know the propaganda on both sides.

We all know that the invisible hand is not as nice as some want us to think, that despite everything we tell us economic liberalism is not only used for the benefit of humanity.

When I look at my country, it is said to be driven by liberalists and capitalists. And yet there free education, there healhcare for everybody and the state help you pay your rent if you are poor on top of giving you a minimal ammount of money if you have no job. In that last case, if you are not too stupid, you can live in a small town with cheap rents and have a decent life. If actually you know how to cook (so food is cheap) and also the basics of economics you can even live quite well. If that's not enough even if it is forbidden will have a work on the side, undeclared to help a bit. For a few hours works they finally have the same has people working full time.

In my country, most people have a long life, decent security, a roof for themselve and lot of food. Most of them can get the new TV/phone whentever when they want. They may not be able to get the most expensive, but they can have it. For that to work, they have to typically work about 35-40 hours a week, with about 5-7 weeks of vacations, their weekends and basically between 23 years old to 65 years old. Before they study or do nothing and after they retire and can do what they want.

Last weekend I discussed with a friend of mine, a romanian girl and I asked how it was when she was young, living in a communist country.

She explained that you had allowance and tickets for everything Flour, oil, bread and so on. You had an orange for christmas but only if you got lucky to be well placed in the queue. When she saw a girl at school that have some meat in its food, she knew the parent were likely well regarded by the party.

if you wanted anything actually you had to wake up earlier to wait in line for anything you may need. So she did that before going to school. She remember one time, waiting in line before the oppening of the shop. her father came to take place in the queue where she was as of course a child alone would be denied access. This is when her father was beatten by the people in the queue for not waiting like the others.

Another time she saw an old woman beaten because she tried to keep an oignon for herself. An oignon that the woman herself made grow...

To survive, the familly was indeed making alcohol. For some reason this was not forbidden or at least tolerated. So the grand mother was making alcohol and was selling to others to get the bit of extra and missing thing to get a not too terrible life.

In the mean time the country said for itself that everybody within had a fantastic life, with a great communism system and showed that their were so productive with their system that they could export lot of wheat. They prevented their own people to have access to it, but sold it cheap to capitalist country to show how successfull their system was.

It is a bit like the 5 people are richer than half the worldwide population.

How so? Do they live longer than the cummulated life than 3.5 billions peoples ? Do they eat more than 3.5 billions people ? Do even they have more real estate ? More childrens? Bigger familly? Maybe they have more power... We could try it 5 guy in a war or martial art against a mob of 3.5 billion people. I wonder who would win ?

No they have from some computation by some organization a bigger number on a computer, that number called money in a way that most of the 3.5 billion poor people do not have. For that to work, we ensure that most of the things the 3.5 billions have is worth nothing and evaluated in some currency that is heavily devaluated toward others. What ever they may have, it doesn't count.

How much do you think the ONG valuated the hundred cows the massai guy own ? How much do you think the ONG evaluate the smartphones of the poors ? In France 1 cow worth is about 1000€. So the masaii own 100K€. Do you really think they counted it that way? No the masaii guy hasn't 100K€ in the bank so it is counted for 0. In china, people spend as much for their smartphone as in france, that it about 200-300€. There 700 millions owners, just in china. Theses guys, just with their smartphone that's at least 140 billions euros.

Also typically, theses study forget obvious stuff. Most young people start with nothing and accumulate over time even if that not much. On top of evaluating everything these guy accumulate for nothing, they forget that almost half of the worldwide population is very young...

Basically if you just count the cost of the clothes these poor people are actually wearing, how much it would cost them to buy in US or France, you'd already find the assertion to be flawed.

Finally is it really the goal of most people to have a bigger number on a computer ? Yeah it was really the goal of the communist country to export more wheat to proove that its model was working. They had something to proove. And they didn't care what second it meant for their population to suffer. Because their model was completely flawed.

But the massaii, he value much more 100 cows than 100K€. And most so called poor people their value their life, their child, their freetime and so own much more than a bit of money at the bank. This is actually true for most people.

If so few people are rich, it is also because being rich isn't that interresting. If anyway you still have to work, or to work more, having more money give you much less than what you think. And if we are just counting people that don't work and are free to use their time how they feel as the real wealthiness, the so called poor people have much more real weathliness than the few rich people.