To be clear, this study was conducted by a woman and she concluded that
while the attrition numbers aren’t great, I’m massively encouraged by the fact that at least in these findings, it’s not about systemic bias against women or women being bad at computers or whatever. Rather, it’s about women being bad at dusting themselves off after failing, which, despite everything, is probably a lot easier to fix.
Also, I never once said the solution was to "man up" or anything of that nature. To frame it in a way that paints me as sexist further illustrates my original point.
He/Him/His
I'm a Software Engineer and a teacher.
There's no feeling quite like the one you get when you watch someone's eyes light up learning something they didn't know.
Yes, I noticed the article was written by a woman, and if I was a woman that would be the conclusion I would take from the article as well (the alternative would be to leave the industry, as I would have no hope of changing it on my own).
As a man though, the lesson I take is WTH is wrong with this industry? Why can't we make an environment where women (and others who happen to be of the more sensitive type) feel more welcome for what they bring to the table rather than force them to mold to the environment?
And to clarify, this will make it an environment where everyone feels welcome. I don't know a single person who thrives on criticism and down-putting. At most, some people adjust to it better than others.
Also, I never once said the solution was to "man up" or anything of that nature.
Not quite in those words, but it was implied by the idea that when women have a harder time adjusting to negativity than men, the proposed solution was to have women emulate the men rather than having the men adjust their behavior.
If encouraging people to brush themselves off and to not give up will ultimately help them achieve their goals, then that is what I'm going to do. This aligns philosophically with the idea that you cannot change everyone else, you can only change yourself.
If you disagree that this is a good solution, that's fine. It's a difference of opinion. But a solution that involves baseless attacks on someone's character is not a solution.
He/Him/His
I'm a Software Engineer and a teacher.
There's no feeling quite like the one you get when you watch someone's eyes light up learning something they didn't know.
Yes, when a newbie comes to me and they are all discouraged because they were shot down by some nasty comment I have no choice but to tell them to brush it off and not to let a few jerks convince them that they are any less of a programmer.
That does NOT mean that there is nothing wrong with the community and that we should not try to change and make a more inclusive environment.
But a solution that involves baseless attacks on someone's character is not a solution.
I don't think anyone was attacking anyone's character, the attacks (if you want to call people's frustration that), were against the community and those insisting that the way it is is the way it should be.
I'm a developer who likes testing first, iterative processes, and refactoring, and I care about quality. I speak both C and Ruby with some facility, and enjoy both, which confuses some people.
We should strive to be welcoming, inclusive, and encouraging for people who make honest mistakes, and try to avoid driving them away with harsh responses.
We should encourage people to pursue their interests despite the fact there are unpleasant people in the world who try to shut them down.
We should not attack each other personally when discussing how to deal with the fact some people are easily discouraged when someone attacks them personally.
Learn from each other a bit, in other words, and be the change we'd like to see in the world.
By the way, while W. Brian Gourlie's manner is a bit brusque, I also found Yechiel Kalmenson's characterization of W's commentary as "toxic masculinity" pretty offensive. That, I'm pretty sure, is what primarily prompted W to respond negatively (with reference to "attacks on someone's character"), on a personal level, to what Yechiel said.
He/Him/His
I'm a Software Engineer and a teacher.
There's no feeling quite like the one you get when you watch someone's eyes light up learning something they didn't know.
To be clear, this study was conducted by a woman and she concluded that
Also, I never once said the solution was to "man up" or anything of that nature. To frame it in a way that paints me as sexist further illustrates my original point.
Yes, I noticed the article was written by a woman, and if I was a woman that would be the conclusion I would take from the article as well (the alternative would be to leave the industry, as I would have no hope of changing it on my own).
As a man though, the lesson I take is WTH is wrong with this industry? Why can't we make an environment where women (and others who happen to be of the more sensitive type) feel more welcome for what they bring to the table rather than force them to mold to the environment?
And to clarify, this will make it an environment where everyone feels welcome. I don't know a single person who thrives on criticism and down-putting. At most, some people adjust to it better than others.
Not quite in those words, but it was implied by the idea that when women have a harder time adjusting to negativity than men, the proposed solution was to have women emulate the men rather than having the men adjust their behavior.
If encouraging people to brush themselves off and to not give up will ultimately help them achieve their goals, then that is what I'm going to do. This aligns philosophically with the idea that you cannot change everyone else, you can only change yourself.
If you disagree that this is a good solution, that's fine. It's a difference of opinion. But a solution that involves baseless attacks on someone's character is not a solution.
Yes, when a newbie comes to me and they are all discouraged because they were shot down by some nasty comment I have no choice but to tell them to brush it off and not to let a few jerks convince them that they are any less of a programmer.
That does NOT mean that there is nothing wrong with the community and that we should not try to change and make a more inclusive environment.
I don't think anyone was attacking anyone's character, the attacks (if you want to call people's frustration that), were against the community and those insisting that the way it is is the way it should be.
I think the takeaway here is that:
We should strive to be welcoming, inclusive, and encouraging for people who make honest mistakes, and try to avoid driving them away with harsh responses.
We should encourage people to pursue their interests despite the fact there are unpleasant people in the world who try to shut them down.
We should not attack each other personally when discussing how to deal with the fact some people are easily discouraged when someone attacks them personally.
Learn from each other a bit, in other words, and be the change we'd like to see in the world.
By the way, while W. Brian Gourlie's manner is a bit brusque, I also found Yechiel Kalmenson's characterization of W's commentary as "toxic masculinity" pretty offensive. That, I'm pretty sure, is what primarily prompted W to respond negatively (with reference to "attacks on someone's character"), on a personal level, to what Yechiel said.
Point taken.